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Idealized, Devalued, Dumped, Discarded – Narcissist’s Approach-Avoidance Cycles
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Remarkable dissection of Narcissistic behaviour! Sam Vaknin, you're metaphors and careful attention to lexicological choices to create transparency brings an otherwise complex subject into an intelligible form for those who wish to have a far better understanding of, shall I say, a fascinating and yet lethal psychological dilemma. Thank you for the special layering of mental gamesmanship you have studied and in turn constructed for public review.
The more i listen to all the various videos, the more i am in total disbelief and sometimes even disgusted to know that they just go through a constant cycle of destruction! They could have the best person ever, in their life, and they would find a way to destroy the relationship, even if it means making up stuff that just never happened and isn't true at all!! But listening to this video i started to think… because they have that trapped kid inside of them that the false self is trying to protect… and because they are an adult now, but with many kid like tendencies, perceptions, etc… the reason why they get bored fast is the same way a child plays with a toy and then gets bored, of the toy, and picks up another toy to play with! Maybe they look at us like toys and they just constantly need a new toy! In other videos they say they look at us as objects and a toy is an object, so maybe it's all one in the same… what a horrible way to treat anyone!
I was told by my ex narcissist that she would discuss with me anything that would be important in our relationship if things changed, she never did, only after I was told her feelings had changed a couple of months before we split, I was being played for a good while in her silly game..
This is my ex. I'm mad at myself for not seeing this earlier. He left me drained and questioning my self worth.
this on the intro.. i find society at large have black n white sociology confirmed pattern of projecting stereitype stigma walL street market utilitarian function to or preporeposition any next to behaviour. counter chain reaction dependency cource of events. .. i dunno what rest developed to. property beyond my control. but, i say GOD SAVE THE QUEEN. I WANNA BE SEDADED
The approach-avoidance cycle is one of the major aspects that caused me to go full no contact with the narc I knew. After the last avoidance event, I just got fed up with the tantrums they'd have and all their sulking and pouting and acting offended and angry etc. It was all on repeat mode for years and tiresome to deal with and growing worse and more frequent the older they got. Of course, they'd always come back after a random length of time but now, I refuse to accept them back. They have no choice in the matter. They're done. That being said, they've already tried to make contact again after several months of their current tantrum and I simply didn't answer the phone and never will. If they come to my door acting all friendly and as if they've never shown their ass (as they've done many times in the past) I simply won't bother answering that either. And I feel I owe them no explanation- not that any explanation would suffice to make them understand anyway.I simply view them as something out of my past that is non productive , non beneficial and unhealthy to be around. Therefore, I choose to let them fade into history and vanish from sight forever.
how very accurate.
Do you think that people like this can actually change? even if they reunite with their family after more than a decade, even after they move to their original "home" city? Even after meeting the right person?
Got your book Sam, and I love it. Lots of insight. Now, I must say that in my experience, when the narcissist is rejected and/or dumped that is when he/she pulls out their claws and does all those bad things to you the objectified object of their desire turned object of their hatred. As long as they are kept on their little pedestal that they built for themself, all is well. They shower you with gifts, etc. but say "no" one time and it's over! They can't handle "no." Nobody is supposed to tell them "no." I usually can weed out a narcissist by telling them "no." Like, "no" I can't do that, or "no" you can't do that. A regular person would just say "ok" and maybe ask you why, but not the narcissist. The reaction is almost immediate. In their mind no one (excuse the pun) is supposed to deny them anything, ever. So once I see the reaction to "no" I know who/what I'm dealing with.
When you mix someone with BPD tendencies and a Narcissist together I guess there are many fireworks.I am happy that I smacked him around now. No reason to feel guilty. He deserved it.I did get therapy and changed my ways. But hearing all of this…now makes me feel this way. I can tell you so many stories about how he used to tell me all the people he screwed over and he seemed to be proud of these accomplishments too. I wish I knew who I was dealing with at the time.
the more and more that i learn about narcs, the more it sickens me to know that THAT IS EXACTLY what i have been dealing with all these years!!! NO WONDER i have been going crazy!!! And my poor kids!!
The narcissist/sociopath takes on a false self as his self has been shattered. Its his only way to survive, otherwise he is virtually non existent. He feels disorientated and searches for parts of himself but he cannot find them or finds small parts. It's a disturbing confusing and frightening time, this is the way I see it. So the false self that he chooses to adopt, – of course he would want to choose all the best qualities to adopt and learn all the right things to say. Read books like the 'five languages of love' so that he knows about love. But?? this is what bothers me – the false self, as it is false how can it stay stable and consistent as it is but something that has been more or less copied and pasted, so therefore it is weak. Doesn't he forget parts of his false self and have to re-invent? Isn't it a bit like re-inventing the wheel all the time? Obviously the false self takes away that feeling of emptiness, disorientation and not knowing oneself, but Is it not frustrating and tiring, especially for someone in their 60s. Obviously I have a subject in mind but nethertheless I am curious. And finally, they know that their love or 'their version' of love is different from ours so why project on to their partner that they are the ones that do not know how to love. Is it because they really believe this or are they trying to confuse their partner hoping that the partner is completely stupid enough to even consider it?
I think Facebook is crack for us narcissists.. I need to take a deeper look at what's important to me… This guy sounds like he knows me.. LOL
This is one trait that is in ALL 4 of them. I think they are more phony and slick with antisocial or histrionic.
Look for the get out card ,plan well expect his family to back him .his mother is dangerous to you .she wants your money your pension and your house and your kids. She wants to prove her middle aged low life son is worth something by using other people's money – mine , no chance make me poor so he can waste my hard work whilst his money was spent in pub and drugs. No way protect yourself at all odds when to know there is a narcisist or more I. The family. BE CAREFUL.
Useful information, thank you.
WOW… simply wowed. you 100% read 30 yrs of my life ~ the cycles!!!!! valued, devalued, wanted not wanted… as i watched him switch careers almost 10 times..be superior in any job only to be so stressed then bored.. blaming company or workers , carry on affairs..and his high when they idolized him and his lows when things started becoming stressful with the new girlfriend he was hiding i know now it was because he cant hide his true identity too long.. he stayed with me because I was his stable source of supply when career or girlfriends turned on him. . these type of people dont know how to love even though they say they love their children or spouse. its all about gaining their own self supply to feel good about themselves to get ready for the next hunt. the more they seek the more broke they get.but never broke enough to want help.. its like a mouse on a wheel.. and they cant stop no matter how insanely broken, they just keep spinning. Those who try to help them stop .. watch out.
Each of your videos I have watched so far (3) has eloquently pinpointed aspects of what I have been experiencing and has offered hope and insight in areas where I was uncertain what to do and why I felt the way I have. This all helps so very much. Things are so much clearer. Thank you.
Thank you so much. I have been struggling for years to figure out why my husband of ten years could just pick up and dump me at the drop of a hat with very little remorse. It's been so painful and I am so grateful this video was produced.
I know. This all so well….I sit here once again..Knott in stomach…I quietly wished please. ..please no. !,.No,,,not this one,..please…not this one,….my feelings are real!!,
My intentions are real….not this one….
,,,knowing the day of unimaginable pain would come…..like a skydiver who's parachute failed to open…watching the inevitable rapidly approaching. ….
They never cease to fascinate me…
…I know there was a real person in there. ..I know it….its so hard to accept the fraud, ,and that it was all a fraud..,…I knew I would outmatch her in the beginning. ..I knew it..she was so bad at the games…in always keep in everything moving..every body guessing…she was a horrible liar…the attempts to revise history with a small change here,,,an omission there. …when I think about it she was sad,,,,,she was a covert narc, avoidance personality. ..BUT, ,I'm not a narc, ,,I'm an empath co dependent kind of guy….see..,,she kept her main supply narc relationship in reserve. ,he was always hovering somewhere out there. ..eventually went back…it was amazing how absolutely oblivious she was to the fact that maintaining a relationship with, a former lover was unacceptable and dysfunctional, she had to maintain it protect it…even the slightest. ..just in case,,,,..
I read a journal of hers,,,she wrote,,,,".always seeking pleasure from people…but only causing pain, and hurt,,,,,,but it never being totally my fault"…that scared me much,,,,,,as I read it. At first. I thought wow there is some reflection, this,,,this.is.why I love.her
Then. .as I read,,,,but..it..never really being my fault…..shocked me….scared me….even in here own private intimate thoughts.,,her fears. .,of responsibility. ..it.was creepy. ,
…they are a weird bunch. ….she's the last,,and fittingly the most painful. …funny how.they are so predictable. ..and they never get it,,,..we see right them,,,,love them,,so Much,,for who.they really are,,,,we know!…but.their so afraid..,they have to keep the act…..I lowered myself worth to be with her.,so much I became like her…..I could feel her resentment she hated confidence, ,crazy
A nightmare from which you struggle to awake…all hosted by pure evil
Sam has a video; old narcissistic supply. After their life fails, and they did everything and anything to keep you as a possession; their children, and their job, as well, they have nothing left; that is when they get older. Then, suddenly, you matter–Wow! You matter now; and that is how the control works. You should have mattered all along.
I was with a N man for 5 years…I have watched all of your footage….I was unaware 5 years ago, around year 3-3.5 it became clear to me that something was wrong. …I've spent the last year + moving away from him..and severing the relationship. ..I learned a lot about myself, I have learned to love myself and set proper boundaries. …this, was truly the worst experience of my life! The sad thing is It took me 5 years to get out….But I'm happier than ever!
It sounds so terrifying but is all true…I've been trough all of this…still having shivers down my spine remembering all this torment…these people truly act like monsters, I just wish i didn't had them in my life, it would be so much better…and how come that they always pray on genuine people who truly love to kill their hopes and dreams??
What is it called Sam when the Narc uses parts of other peoples personality to draw another person or adopts as his own?